KeralaBrethren.net
New User? Register Today!
Registered Users, LOGIN
What we believe (Eng) What we believe (Mal) About Us Contact Us
Forums Home General Forum Youth Forum Sisters Forum Archives (2005-2007) Archives (2001-2004)
Listing of Brides Listing of Grooms
Assemblies in Kerala Evangelists in India Instituitions in India
Christian Albums Christian Songs
Audio Sermons Bible Wallpapers Brethren Links KB History (Eng) KB History (Mal)

K E R A L A  B R E T H R E N
General Forum (2005 - 2007)

Forums Home ::
This Message Forum is to discuss spiritual topics only. Please avoid personal or assembly matters.
Let us use this facility for our spiritual enrichment and for bringing glory to our Lord almighty.
Webmasters reserve the right to delete any topic or posting partly or completely from this forum.
View Topics ::

Go to bottom of the page

# 01422 :  Eunuchs
Dear brethren,
Just two days back, I was travelling by a public bus, in which two eunuchs were there. When left, people were making fun of them, and I realized, that how much they were neglected and despised, here especially in North Indian culture. But as i was reading through the book of Isaiah, I read of eunuchs, and also remebered the N.T. in book of Acts, were eunuch was convertrd. But they are despised in other cultures. Are there people who minister to the eunuchs today?
Are eunuchs included in the body of Christ?
Here in Bengal, eunuchs comes when babies are born to a family, and demand money. Its a permission grabnted by governments. Is it the same in the places where you stay?
Do we who are beleivers treat them well?
Please pray for them.
May God bless them too.

Sincerely in Christ,
Tinka

Post by : tinka  View Profile    since : 15 Oct 2007


Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 15 Oct 2007 5:03:14 AM Close
Dear Sister tinka in Christ,
Mathew:19
11But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.
12For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.
13Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.
14But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

Acts 8
26And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise, and go toward the south unto the way that goeth down from Jerusalem unto Gaza, which is desert.
27And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship,
28Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.
29Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.
30And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?
31And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.
32The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:
33In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.
34And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?
Contd/-
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 15 Oct 2007 5:09:01 AM Close
Contd/-
35Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
36And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
39And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
40But Philip was found at Azotus: and passing through he preached in all the cities, till he came to Caesarea


Dear Sister every living soul is a soul, if he or she has the capability of understanding the truth and fact, it is our first anf foremost duty to tell them the truth, often as you have mentioned they are a neglected group altogether and always insulted, hence thier retaliation towards normal men and women are sometimes aggresive, but the price of our soul and thier soul are one.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : mom23   View Profile   Since : 15 Oct 2007 10:18:56 AM Close
Dear sis.Tinka,
You bought up a topic that is interesting as well as something to think and pray about.
As part of my education, I actually had an opportunity during the course of 2 years to work with this group - not only the eunuchs, the gays, commercial sexworkers etc. It was interesting mainly because it was a reality check for me on how perceptions & preconceived notions can be so deceiving in our evaluation of another human being.
They are an intersting group from a social point of view because most of them are not eunuchs in the true sense of the word...they are not born that way. 90% of them are men, usually married with families back home in the village from where they migrate to the big cities in search of better prospects. Prospects are never good or easy. So, it becomes a matter of feeding the stomach that gravitates them towards such a lifestyle. They usually just cross-dress, consume female hormonal pills that diminish their maleness or they actually undergo a procedure for sex alteration. They adopt the life style that goes with it, which is risky, dangerous and it reflects on how low human beings can truly fall. It is an ugly world.
One of their source of income is going to homes with new babies, as well as in Mumbai they used to have thursdays, where they go to establishments too to get a small payment or they threaten to harrass them/their customers etc. They work on societies general "fear" of them. Fear which is really because of their own prejudices and their unwillingness to understand. Unfortunately, they pass this fear and prejudice, onto the next generation too.
I, too, approached them with my own preconceived notions, but they were so good with me, they helped me as best as they could in my research.

cont...

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : mom23   View Profile   Since : 15 Oct 2007 10:31:50 AM Close
cont..

There was nobody working among them, except social workers...but I don't know their situation now. They only had 1 NGO for their support group, (don't know if there are more), in Mumbai. I don't know how it is now, it has been 5 years...but then there were nobody spreading the gospel among them.
But you cannot just walk into their homes and give them the gospel....the approach for such groups requires a lot of patience and time. It requires us to first get ourselves educated with their life and lifestyle, their fears, their worries etc. Because of the way they are looked upon by the general population, they too have trust issues, but they are very accepting and they are a population that really need the good news about our Lord and His saving grace.

Like bro.Samuel said, they too are souls that are important, but because of poverty and various other problems, they are the way they are...but Jesus shed his blood for them too...so they too are worth it. That itself should open our eyes and lessen our fears.

It is good to see a fellow sister, sensitive to and willing to think about the downtrodden in society. I will pray for that wonderful spirit God has blessed you with...it is a gift. Hope some of this information was useful to you. Take care.

In prayers,
Judy.

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tinka   View Profile   Since : 16 Oct 2007 1:35:50 AM Close
Dear brethren, bro Samuel, and sis. Judy,
Indeed your replies were helpful, but bro Samuel, would you kindly expound on
“12For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men…”
Does it refer to as sis Judy said?
“they are not born that way. 90% of them are men, usually married with families back home in the village from where they migrate to the big cities in search of better prospects. Prospects are never good or easy. So, it becomes a matter of feeding the stomach that gravitates them towards such a lifestyle. They usually just cross-dress, consume female hormonal pills that diminish their maleness or they actually undergo a procedure for sex alteration.”
Well dear sister, your reply was really helpful, and it’s really mournful news, to read of such ways that men are adopting. I wonder how this group were not reached by the Gospel workers. Its really surprising to hear that unlike how we have missions amidst prisoners, etc. we don’t have any among them. They who live a peace less life, who are despised of men, very poor and lost…who need Christ more than the righteous of the world…there, are none to share with them. We should sincerely pray for them. Well, is this the case in all states of India and abroad?
May I ask a question… are the eunuchs a result of sin coming down into the world (effect of sin on humanity, as we know of death and diseases), or are they according to God’s perfect plan in creation?
Funnily, in relation to the society’s attitude to them, the Bible gives a vastly different view regarding the Scriptures. I know, here among the people, they believe that these people are “aashuv” (ominous) and if they curse, they come true… and various things like that. Men are scared as they observe that when they (eunuchs) get angry, on refusal of the money they demand, they do obscene things, which are very embarrassing to see.
contd...
Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tinka   View Profile   Since : 16 Oct 2007 1:36:08 AM Close
I don’t know why they are denied of education, and right to work at offices, or why even the Government doesn’t do much to help them.
But what you dear sister said of men under-going sex-alteration is deplorable, and is definitely due to men’s sinful nature.
Sister dear, you mentioned that we can’t go to their home and share the Gospel, but I’m doubtful how and where they stay. How did you reach to these people? Were you in some group or alone?
Let’s uphold this group in our prayers, and pray specially that the Lord would raise people to share the Gospel among them.

In Christian love and prayers,
Tinka

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : mom23   View Profile   Since : 17 Oct 2007 2:14:28 PM Close
Dear sis.Tinka,
I am not an expert on their life and all the sociologial issues. And I don't know their life or lifestyles in other places in India or out of India.
Their embarrassing and obscene behaviour is just a "defense mechanism"...they work or prey on society's embarrassment of certain behaviours and it gets them the money they want from you, right?
They aren't denied anything by the government...but their way of earning money is pretty lucrative...most of them are hardly educated to get work in offices and they would earn so much more through their other ways...which includes more than just collecting "haftha" from shopkeepers. But that is why their life style choices are dangerous and unhealthy.
The people I worked with lived in like a colony in a very bad part of town...or it has that reputation. Anyway, I went through an agency and soon they got to know me, so the other trouble makers leave you alone. That is why I said, you cannot just walk into their homes...building of a tentative trust/friendship is needed to tell them about what our Lord can do in their lives. It is not easy, you see the beggars/the streetchildren/the sex workers/the eunuchs etc. are not in the job they are in out of their own free will....they are there because of circumstance and they cannot or are not allowed to get out...death is usually the only way out. They are just bringing in the money for the people who own them. It is like a heirarchy right from the bottom.
Giving them access to education or respectable jobs will mess up their owners' money source, so they prey on their uneducation or other superstitious fears.

Hope I have answered some of your questions...like I said though I am not an expert. But you bought up a very important point, I hope someone answers...

"are the eunuchs a result of sin coming down into the world (effect of sin on humanity, as we know of death and diseases), or are they according to God’s perfect plan in creation?"

Take care,
A fellow sister,
Judy.

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : annvarghese   View Profile   Since : 17 Oct 2007 6:13:05 PM Close
While I was in Bombay I had couple of interesting encounters with hijras. When I first arrived I was kind of weary of them. One day they came begging and one of them touched my feet. Naturally I pulled away and he said “Baby don’t be scared. My blood is red like yours”. That changed my perspective and put an end to my weariness towards them.
I met a natural eunuch once. He narrated his sad story how his family rejected him. His family raised him as a boy but once he became a young adult they didn’t want anything to do with him. They threw him out of the house. Alone in the world his only solace was the hijras. So he joined them where he lives without fear, as they are extremely protective of their core group.

Natural eunuchs are rare. But most of the eunuchs you see in these major cities are men who have been castrated. Some of them have been made that way when they were kidnapped while they were young. So as they grow up they have no other choice but to join the group. Some of them are homosexuals who cannot survive in that lifestyle outside and choose to be this way so they can live the life they choose to.

They are all lost souls like we were once. Not many in believing circles have reached out to them, as they are a difficult group to penetrate to. Their outward behavior is a defense mechanism as Sis. Judy put it.
I’m aware of one ministry that is catered to Eunuchs. This is their website http://www.agapeindia.com/eunuch_bible.htm.

Question sis. Judy raised can be answered only for those who are natural eunuchs.
If it is sin coming down to the earth why only few are chosen to suffer in this manner? If they are created according to God’s perfect plan, what is that plan?

Ann

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tomj   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2007 8:12:33 AM Close
Ann wrote….

“If it is sin coming down to the earth why only few are chosen to suffer in this manner? If they are created according to God’s perfect plan, what is that plan?”

This is a very big theological question. Let me say few things, not many details. Sin (Gen chapter 3) is the source of all infirmities. God created everything perfect. Sin destroyed the perfect creation.

All subsequent generations are destined to suffer the consequences of sin. The question we may ask God is this; “God why did you spare me from the severe maladies of sin? I could have been the one in the slums of Bombay working as a sex worker; the eunuch; the leper.”

Then God may guide us to read Eph 1:4-6.

“Just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will”

God’s answer is this – I (God) did this according to the good PLEASURE OF MY WILL!

We, the inheritors of sin have no stand in asking the question the other way around; God why are you allowing suffering to some? Let us say; thank you God that you ‘predestined me to adoption as Your son/ daughter’ and You did not allow all the gruesomeness of sin from Genesis 3 on, manifest in my life.

Ann, we cannot ask the question ‘why only few are chosen to suffer?’--- ALL are destined to suffer; few of us are chosen NOT to suffer as others do. Also, an eternal deliverance is just around the corner for those who trust in the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of their sins! Praise to His wonderful and matchless Name.

Regards,

Tom J


Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2007 9:15:35 AM Close
Dear Br.Tom in Christ,

<<God why did you spare me from the severe maladies of sin? I could have been the one in the slums of Bombay working as a sex worker; the eunuch; the leper.”>>

Dear br. I am very much low in the knowledge of scriptures comparing with you, therefore due to ignorance I may ask you a question,
Every human bieng born in this world is a sinner, and the only remedy to get saved is through believing on the sacrifice our Savior Lord Jesus Christ on the cross of calvary for our sins, and when we believe with our heart and confesses with our mouth we are saved.

I leave the sex worker aside, because it is nowadays a profession done by cirumstances knowingly, but eunuch and leper , what is the mistake of this respective human , either by birth they are eunuch and a person doesnt willingly become a leper. Is this souls are not like normal human souls , didnt our savior Lord Jesus christ heal lepers physically, didnt the eunuch of ethiopa was delivered the Gospel by Philip, because these souls were also predestined by God, was not the woman of Samria given the living waters, John 3:16 , For God so loved the world, so that he gave his only begotten son, for whosoever believeth in him shall not persih but have everlasting life. Is the salvation restricted from the external visible sin of the leviticus.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2007 10:48:00 AM Close
Isa 56:3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: NEITHER LET THE EUNUCH SAY, Behold, I am a dry tree.

4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and A NAME BETTER THAN of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

==========

If any of you happen to speak to Eunuch's about the gospel of Christ, I suggest that you show this Scripture portion to them.

In Christ Jesus,
Moses Lemuelraj

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tomj   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2007 11:07:02 AM Close
Bro Samuel,

You have asked – “what is the mistake of this respective human, either by birth they are eunuch and a person doesn’t willingly become a leper. Is this souls are not like normal human souls-” [please read the paragraph above, not quoting in its entirety]

I am not saying I have the answers to these questions. The ultimate answer would be that ‘I don’t know’! But here are some points to consider.

These terrible things, birth defects, dreaded diseases, mental illnesses etc. etc. do occur because of sin; not because of sins the parents or the baby have committed, but because of SIN itself.

Job’s life is the best example. He suffered not because of his own personal sin, but because of the SIN itself. Every person ever lived have gone through the maladies of SIN- some more, some less. Job didn’t understand why God had allowed the things He did, but he knew that God was good and continued to trust in Him. (Job 1:21)

John 9:2-3 "His disciples asked Him, 'Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?' 'Neither this man nor his parents sinned,' said Jesus, 'but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life.'

God provided the “cure” for sin - (Romans 5:8). Once we get to heaven we will be free from sickness, disease, and death. Until that day, we will have to deal with sin, its effects, and its consequences.

Contd.

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tomj   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2007 11:12:39 AM Close
One might easily say; this is the typical cop-out sayings of the Christians! Not really. Christians trust in the ultimate goodness and mercy of a loving God. He ‘makes ALL things work together for good to those who love him, to those who are called according to His purpose (Rom 8:29).

What is the proof? God sent His Son, Lord Jesus Christ to die on the cross, so we can be free from, and of the maladies of sin. When Job was sitting in the ashes and his flesh was rotting away and the insects attacked his body, Job could at least raise his hands and use the potsherd to scratch his body.

When our Savior was hanging on the cross His hands were nailed to the cross so that He couldn’t even raise them to shoo away the insects or rub on his pierced body, on that gruesome dark day, when He paid the penalty of my sins.

This is how God loved the humanity. No one can in this life escape the horrific manifestations of sin upon thier body and mind. How can we ask God why He allows what He allows?

Job 38:4 - “ Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? Tell Me, if you have understanding.”

Job 38:9-11 - When I made the clouds its garment, and thick darkness its swaddling band; when I fixed My limit for it, and set bars and doors; when I said, ‘This far you may come, but no farther, and here your proud waves must stop!’

This is our God- the God who chose me (Eph 1:4) to become His child! Can I figure that out?

Regards,

Tom J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2007 5:17:49 AM Close
Dear br.Tom in Christ,

<<These terrible things, birth defects, dreaded diseases, mental illnesses etc. etc. do occur because of sin; not because of sins the parents or the baby have committed, but because of SIN itself.>>

Is there any remedy for this sins ? A normally born human bieng in this world is a born sinner, his soul is bieng redeemed by the precious blood of our christ, As per your saying and quoted, do this above said terrible things, they have internal sin, which is seen by God , and the external sin which is seen physically.A leper who is not healed physically accepts Lord as the personal savior, is he not redeemed from his eternal sin.Is he not a member of the body of the Christ ? Suppose it happens to any of our children or close kith or kin, we are reddemed from the sin and as you said the children are innocent, how can we get redeemed from it.


Yours in christ
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tomj   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2007 9:49:16 AM Close
Dear Bro. Samuel,

Parts of your questions were not very clear to me. But I am trying to answer to the best way I understood the questions. Please rephrase the questions if I messed up the intended meaning.

"Is there any remedy for this sins?"

....There is deliverence for believers, to some extend here on earth, but permanently once glorified.

"A normally born human bieng in this world is a born sinner, his soul is bieng redeemed by the precious blood of our christ, As per your saying and quoted, do this above said terrible things, they have internal sin, which is seen by God , and the external sin which is seen physically."

....Physical illness is not necessarily the result of personal sin. It can happen as a judgment from God to His children. But that is more of an exception than normal.

"A leper who is not healed physically accepts Lord as the personal savior, is he not redeemed from his eternal sin.Is he not a member of the body of the Christ ?"

..... Most certainly! He may still die as a leper, but will be resurrected and become perfect.

"Suppose it happens to any of our children or close kith or kin, we are reddemed from the sin and as you said the children are innocent, how can we get redeemed from it."

(I am not sure if I understood this q. correctly.)

Even when we are saved, as long as we live on this earth that is CURSED BY GOD to produce thistles and thornes, we have only a limited escape until we are glorified. We live on an earth CURSED BY GOD.. CURSED BY ITS CREATOR!

But our blessed God made everything possible to redeem it. Until that happends the earth is under GOD'S CURSE.. But believers have much to rejoice, because the presence of the Holy Spirit within them makes them stronger than the one outside (Satan).

This gives us much needed protection, yet we live on this corrupt, cursed earth.

Regards,

Tom

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 21 Oct 2007 12:01:36 AM Close
Dear br. Tom in Christ,

Thank you dear brother for sparing some of your valuable time for answering my foolish questions, and what you have answered is correct,

<<Suppose it happens to any of our children or close kith or kin, we are reddemed from the sin and as you said the children are innocent, how can we get redeemed from it."

(I am not sure if I understood this q. correctly.)

I meant that if I & my wife are born again children and we as a family live our life which is pleasing to God, we get a child either is born handicapped, or gets a terrible disease after a couple of years bieng born . As per my understanding from your answers, our internal sins are redeemed by the acceptance of us bieng sinner of the sacrifice on the cross, The child after getting a terrible disease has already a internal sin which can be sanctified by the precious blood and the external sin which is visible physically ,<<but will be resurrected and become perfect>> does the word of God say there is no remedy for this sin, irrespective of the modern treatments available in this era.

In the Old testament and New testament wherever lepers are bieng mentioned after healing they have to get a certification from the high priest to be included in the mainstream, what type of certification is there in this era.
Leviticus 14
3And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper;
4Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop:
5And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water:
6As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water:

Contd/-
Samuel.v.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 21 Oct 2007 12:03:20 AM Close
Contd-2/-
7And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field.
8And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days.
9But it shall be on the seventh day, that he shall shave all his hair off his head and his beard and his eyebrows, even all his hair he shall shave off: and he shall wash his clothes, also he shall wash his flesh in water, and he shall be clean.
10And on the eighth day he shall take two he lambs without blemish, and one ewe lamb of the first year without blemish, and three tenth deals of fine flour for a meat offering, mingled with oil, and one log of oil.
11And the priest that maketh him clean shall present the man that is to be made clean, and those things, before the LORD, at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation:
12And the priest shall take one he lamb, and offer him for a trespass offering, and the log of oil, and wave them for a wave offering before the LORD:
13And he shall slay the lamb in the place where he shall kill the sin offering and the burnt offering, in the holy place: for as the sin offering is the priest's, so is the trespass offering: it is most holy:
14And the priest shall take some of the blood of the trespass offering, and the priest shall put it upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot:
15And the priest shall take some of the log of oil, and pour it into the palm of his own left hand:
16And the priest shall dip his right finger in the oil that is in his left hand, and shall sprinkle of the oil with his finger seven times before the LORD:

Contd/-
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 21 Oct 2007 12:04:27 AM Close
Contd-3/-
17And of the rest of the oil that is in his hand shall the priest put upon the tip of the right ear of him that is to be cleansed, and upon the thumb of his right hand, and upon the great toe of his right foot, upon the blood of the trespass offering:
18And the remnant of the oil that is in the priest's hand he shall pour upon the head of him that is to be cleansed: and the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD.
19And the priest shall offer the sin offering, and make an atonement for him that is to be cleansed from his uncleanness; and afterward he shall kill the burnt offering:
20And the priest shall offer the burnt offering and the meat offering upon the altar: and the priest shall make an atonement for him, AND HE SHALL BE CLEAN.

Matthew 8
1When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him.
2And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.
3And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; BE THOU CLEAN. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed.
4And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, SHEW THYSELF TO THE PRIEST, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tomj   View Profile   Since : 22 Oct 2007 7:51:23 AM Close
Dear Bro Samuel,

You asked - "does the word of God say there is no remedy for this sin,"

Please explain what do you mean by 'sin' here? I have to say, I am not totally following what you are saying here. (Personal sin or the result of sin that is in the world.

What confused me further is yor follow up comment -'irrespective of the modern treatments available in this era.'

[BTW, none of your questions is foolish. I know they are very genuine and I consider it as a privilege even as I try to answer some to the best of my ability]


Regards,

Tom J


Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 22 Oct 2007 8:17:14 AM Close
Dear Br.Tom in Christ,


Though we are deviating from the initial topic of "eunuch" because of other related topics with the same had been discussed, I hope sister tinka will not be offended if we continue the thread without interrupting.

<<Reply by : tomj Since : 18 Oct 2007 11:12:39 : These terrible things, birth defects, dreaded diseases, mental illnesses etc. etc. do occur because of sin; not because of sins the parents or the baby have committed, but because of SIN itself.>>

<<Reply by : nelnob1 Since : 21 Oct 2007 00:01:36 :<<Suppose it happens to any of our children or close kith or kin, we are reddemed from the sin and as you said the children are innocent, how can we get redeemed from it."

(I am not sure if I understood this q. correctly.)

I meant that if I & my wife are born again children and we as a family live our life which is pleasing to God, we get a child either is born handicapped, or gets a terrible disease after a couple of years bieng born . As per my understanding from your answers, our internal sins are redeemed by the acceptance of us bieng sinner of the sacrifice on the cross, The child after getting a terrible disease has already a internal sin which can be sanctified by the precious blood and the external SIN which is visible physically ,<<but will be resurrected and become perfect>> does the word of God say there is no remedy for this SIN, irrespective of the modern treatments available in this era.>>

The visible external sin which is in the form of a dreadful disease , is there no remedy for this sin, In the old testament there was a certification process, In this era we have various modern medical treatments which can heal this dreadful disease , after bieng healed by the doctors of the world, will his or her external sin still be there.Will he or she be perfect only after resurrection.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page

Reply by : tinka   View Profile   Since : 1 Nov 2007 10:31:38 AM Close
Dear brethren,
Sorry I was forced to be out-of-touch with you all, and couldn't follow the thread, because of various social problems..as you would be knowing during the time of "poojas"(peak time of idol worshipping in Bengal, when the entire city was enmeshed in it, all cyber-cafes, were closed, following to that I had to attend the BBTI Bengal2007 conferrance, and preceding to my return, the subsiquent bandhs, I was not able to log onto the net).
Sis, Judy, indeed you did answer many of my questions and ann's reply, I did get some insight, but what I still don't understand is, that they are a seperate gender in themselves, so as redeemed, should we be like them (as we read, we shall be like angels...) or shall they be converted to either of the sexes or be like themselves. Well my original question, which may be like bro Tom said that they are made according to the perfect will of God, then I beleive, that what they are today is only because of soceital response to them.
bro Samuel, did you think I would mind if would've continued the discussion??? you are such a dear brother in christ, and you don't need to take my permission...

with Christian love and regards,
Tinka

Go to top of the page
Go to bottom of the page



Go to top of the page

All times are GMT -5 Hours
Forums Home ::
© 2018 Sansnet.com



HOME