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# 01447 :  New testament baptism-Pouring or immersion
Dear brethren in Christ,

I am bringing forward a topic which was discussed in another thread.

<<Reply by : George P. Koshy Since : 30 Oct 2007 10:26:09
Dear brother Samuel VJ,

In NT, 'pouring' is also called as 'baptism.' 'Sprinkling is never called as 'baptism.'

Shalom Malekim!!! >>


Is believers baptism , what we brethren and many gatherings are following should be pouring or immersion. As per my views baptisms is immersion based on the scriptures , Mark -1 (John Baptises Jesus in River Jordan and also says when Jesus came UP OUT of water), John-3(John baptises in Aenon several people where there was much water), Acts 8 (Philip baptises Eunuch as they went into the water and also says came out of the water).


Opinions awaited from our dear brethren

Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J




Post by : samuel.v.j  View Profile    since : 30 Oct 2007


Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 9 Nov 2007 10:53:18 AM Close
Dear br.George in Christ,

Brother, how is your brother-in-law, always in our prayers, you have a lots of threads to respond , and I would request you to please shower some time of yours in this particular thread also, because we all are born again and one in Christ, and all the born again believers and I am sure as per the scriptures we those who are believers in brethren assemblies, pentecostal gatherings, baptist, they all do Immersion baptism, now dear brother you have mentioned""In NT, 'pouring' is also called as 'baptism.' 'Sprinkling is never called as 'baptism.'""

You are indirectly saying that apart from sprinking, pouring and immersion both are O.K,

In another thread , "hithere"wrote, if there is no river, pond, lake , sea, or a baptism tank nearby , what should be done for the baptism.

Brother I know you have an answer, because you are one among the few in this forums who is well versed with scriptures, and I specially would be eager to know what is the correct way of Believers Baptism, and I would not in anyway respond with an adverse reply.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 12 Nov 2007 1:58:55 PM Close
Dear Samuel VJ,
Part-1

¡§Go and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy spirit; teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have enjoined you.¡¨ Matthew 28:19-20

We see a similar command of Christ to His eleven disciples in Mark 16:16, ¡§He that believes and baptized shall be saved, and he that disbelieves shall be condemned.¡¨

When studying the command of Christ to the eleven on the subject of making disciples of all nations, there are four passages to be considered, and they are: Matthew 28:19-20, Mark 16:15-18, and Luke 24:47, and Acts 1:8. In Acts 1 this action is directly connected with the baptism of the Holy Spirit. In Matthew 28 and Mark 16 the disciples are asked to baptize the people, believers.

There are four different baptisms are mentioned in the Bible. These are easy to recognize by considering the use of the verb BAPTIZO (=baptize) with ƒÕƒÞ (=in). They are (the list may not be exhaustive):

a. Baptize in water (Matthew 3:11; Mark 1:8; John 1:26,31,33)
b. Baptize in the Holy Spirit (Matthew 3:11; Mark 1:8; Luke 3:16; John 1:33; Acts 1:5; 11:16; 1 Corinthians 12:13)
c. Baptize in the name of the Lord (Acts 10:48)
d. Baptized in the cloud and sea (1 Corinthians 10:2)

John 1:33 states that Jesus Christ is the one who baptizes with the Holy Spirit. In Acts 1, Christ asked His disciples to wait till they are baptized with the Holy Spirit to be His witnesses from Jerusalem to Judea, to Samaria, and to the end of the world. From Acts 2, we understand that the baptism that was to be practiced by the disciples is ¡§baptizing in water.¡¨

In Matthew 28:19, the order of activities are Baptizing (BAPTIZONTESƒw, Teaching (DIDASKONTES), and Making Disciples (MAThETEUEIN). Baptism implied a confession of the one who is baptized about his/her condition before God and proclaims it to the world. Teaching implies accepting the authority of the name unto which a person is baptized... (Cont.)

(To be cont. Part-2)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 12 Nov 2007 2:00:12 PM Close
Dear Samuel VJ,
Part-2

... Through baptism a believer becomes a member of the community of disciples, saints. Therefore, infant baptism is not what Christ asked his disciples to perform.

The assembly (EKLESIA) is not merely a spiritual community in love and faith. It was to exhibit visibly in external manifestation. To this, the external right of baptism was instituted and all disciples were to be consecrated. Acts 10:9 shows that even Peter came to this understanding only at a later time.

Various forms of the Greek word ƒnƒvBAPTIZO appear over 122 times in the NT. Almost all of them, except eleven places, KJV have it directly connected with the word ¡§Baptism.¡¨ At the eleven places, the word used are: BAPTO 3 times as DIP or DIPPED, EMBAPTO ƒwƒn3 times as DIPPETH, BAPTIZO 2 times as ¡§wash¡¨ or ¡§washed,¡¦¡¨ and BAPTISMOS 3 times as WASHING. Though these occurrences appear to be not connected with baptism, they should not to be ignored. We are interested in the meaning of baptism, a word derived from the Greek word BAPTIZO. This use of this Greek word, BAPTIZO, in the New Testament is important, because those who insist on the mode of baptism as immersion usually make statements that ¡§immersion¡¨ is the meaning of that Greek word. This action of insisting on the meaning of BAPTIZO as ¡§immersion¡¨ made me do a study about its use in the Word of God and I found that it was also used for pouring. To be accurate, the Bible indubitably calls pouring as an act of baptism.

There are about fifteen times we read the English word ¡§Baptist,¡¨ all of them are in relation to John the Baptist. Fourteen times it is from the Greek word BAPTISTES, and once from BAPTIZO. This is very interesting. Why those who are of the Baptist persuasion are interested to be known after John the Baptist and not after Christ? Only a Baptist can answer this. So let us proceed.

(To be cont. Part-3)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 12 Nov 2007 2:01:25 PM Close
Dear Samuel VJ,
Part-3

In Heb. 6:2 the Greek word BAPTISMOS is translated as the act of BAPTISM in relation to its doctrine -- “The doctrine of baptisms.” Therefore, it may be safe to assume that there is a doctrine associated with it. I assume that the original question posted in this forum was in connection with this doctrine.

We can easily verify that the word BAPTISMA can be found about 22 places in the NT. All of them are translated as “Baptism.” In the Gospels, it is associated with the “Baptism of John,” which is also called “Baptism of repentance.” It is also called “Baptism of repentance for the remission of sin.” In Mark 10:38-39 and Luke 12:50 our Lord taught His disciples about another baptism. In Mark’s Gospel He talks about a cup - the inward suffering, and a baptism - the outward suffering. In Rom. 6:4, we read that we are buried with him in baptism. We read the same in Col. 2:12 also. In Eph. 4:5, we read about “One Lord, one faith, one baptism.” In 1 Peter 3:21 we are told that the baptism does also now save us. When we read this passage along with 1 Pet. 3:18, this is the context, we clearly see that the baptism is related to Christ’s sufferings, death and resurrection. This is a wonderful explanation of BAPTISMA.

The Greek word BAPTIZO appears about 79 times. Out of that about 74 times it is translated as BAPTIZE. John compares his baptism with the baptism that Christ will provide, the two baptisms – baptism with the Holy Spirit and the baptism with fire. Those who are saved by His finished work are baptized with the Holy Spirit by Him and those who are not saved are baptized with fire. John baptized those who came to him in the wilderness seeking to be baptized. Similarly, those of us who went to Him and accepted Him as our Savior are baptized with the Holy Spirit. The leader baptizes his followers. When we are baptized with the Holy Spirit by the Lord Jesus Christ that is to show all other creation that we are His followers... (Cont.)

(To be cont. Part-4)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 12 Nov 2007 2:02:54 PM Close
Dear Samuel VJ,
Part-4

... This is shown to us in the OT. It is referred to in 1 Cor. 10:2 as “Baptized unto Moses.” We read about this baptism when the children of Israel went through the Red Sea, before they started the wilderness journey. This is an important aspect that we should not over look.

The three “I” (Inspiration, Infallibility, and Immutability) of the word of God is to be attributed to as it was originally given. This is the basic axiom on which we should study the scriptures.

The Greek word EN could be translated as ‘in,’ ‘by,’ or ‘with.’ Therefore, baptized in the water, by the water, or with the water are applicable according to context.

John Calvin wrote that John 3:23 is the best argument for those who support immersion as the physical mode of baptism, because there it is written that there was “much” water where the Lord Jesus Christ baptized.

It is generally accepted that the Greek word BAPTIZO means immersion or dip into something, especially in water. Is this the only way the Holy Spirit used this word in the scripture? The answer is an emphatic “NO.”

In Mark 7:4, 8; and Luke 11:38 our Lord Jesus Christ used BAPTIZO for washing by pouring of water. In Hebrew 9:10 BAPTIZMOS (= washing) is used for the washing ordinances of flesh in the first tabernacle. This washing was a ceremonial act. The Jewish ceremonial washing was by pouring and not by immersion in water.

In Acts 1:5 our Lord Jesus Christ said, “You shall be baptized (BAPTIZO) with the Holy Spirit. In Acts 11:15-16 we read that the falling of the Holy Spirit was what was told by Christ in Acts 1:5. In Acts 10:44 we read, “The Holy Spirit fell (EPEPESE) on them.” In Acts 10:45 we read, “That upon the nations also the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out (EKKEXUTAI = was poured out).” In the context what is said to “fell” in 10:44 is explained to us as ”was poured out” in 10:45... (Cont.)

(To be cont. Part-5)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 12 Nov 2007 2:04:00 PM Close
Dear Samuel VJ,
Part-5

... In Acts 11:15 we read, “The Holy Spirit fell upon them even as upon us also at the beginning.” This was Peter's explanation about the incident of Acts 10:44-45. He continued in 11:17, “And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, John baptized with water, but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” The same sense is provided in Acts 2:3-4; 8:14-17; and 19:6.

Therefore, the scripture states that pouring is also a mode of baptism. This is what the Holy Spirit teaches us.

When a person is buried in a cave, it need not be under the ground. It could be in a cave or in a tomb that is made on a rock projecting over the ground. In burial, the body is completely covered by the mud or the rock. In baptism that should take place, the one who is baptized must be covered with water. In sprinkling, this may not happen. Sprinkling is not taught in the scripture as a mode of baptism.

Shalom Malekim!!!

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Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 9:30:05 AM Close
Dear brother George in Christ,

Brother as I wrote before I would not counter with an adverse reply, but as my memory stands, and what I have heard, I have seen and heard only about immersion, denomination go for sprinkling the infants, or immersion baptism for the believers known as believers baptism, but pouring I havent heard.


Why has this pouring baptism never come into practice if it is scriptural in recent eras among born again believers.

<<In baptism that should take place, the one who is baptized must be covered with water. In sprinkling, this may not happen.>> In pouring does this happen, when we pour a mug of water practically, it get wet and dries and never remains covered.

Comments awaited


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:14:28 AM Close
If comments are awaited -

Pouring and sprinkling is all the same. In pouring whole body does not get wet. Take water in your fist and see there are gaps between fingers. Try to pour water. It gets sprinkled all over.

o say that the Greek word, Baptizo (baptizo) means "to sprinkle" is to say that the Greeks had two words meaning "to sprinkle" and none meaning "to immerse." The Greek word Rantizo (Phantizo) is used often in the Bible and means:

1) "Sprinkle" (Greek-English Lexicon of the N. T. by Bauer, Arndt, and Gingrich. Page 741)


"To sprinkle, besprinkle" (An Internediate Greek-English Lexicon, by Liddell and Scott. Page 715)

How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? Heb 9:14

Katharizo (g2511) kath-ar-id'-zo; to cleanse (lit. or fig.): - (make) clean (-se), purge, purify.

Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.Heb.10:22

Although Calvin did not establish the Presbyterian Church, it
was his work and teachings that resulted in its beginning. It was
through the leadership of John Knox that the doctrines of Calvin
were brought to Scotland. The Presbyterian Church was the result
of Knox's efforts. Knox wrote for it the first articles of faith.
The "Westminister Assembly," which met in Westminister, England,
from 1643 to 1649, wrote the "Westminister Confession of Faith,"
and the "Larger and Shorter Catechisms," which have remained as
the creed of Presbyterianism.

From the foundation laid by the teachings of John Calvin there
have come various Presbyterians Groups, such as, the "Huguenots"
of France, the "Puritans" of England, the "Covenanters" of
Scotland and the "Dutch Reformed Church" of Holland.

(Churches of Today, Tomlinson, page 43.)

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:16:42 AM Close
John Calvin was tremendously influential in the Protestant world. He is generally credited with being the spiritual father of Prebyterianism and the Reformed Churches. But he himself had been significantly influenced by Augustine (354-430). One authority says that “Calvin often read the Biblical text through the eyes of Augustine . . .” (Westminster Dictionary of Church History, p. 148).

“Whether the person baptized is to be wholly immersed . . . or whether he is only to be sprinkled with water, is not of the least consequence: churches should be at liberty to adopt either, according to the diversity of climates, although it is evident that the term baptize means to immerse, and that this was the form used by the primitive Church” (Institutes, 1975 ed., Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, II, 524.)

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:20:20 AM Close
"We ought to consider that at whatever time we are baptized, we are washed and purified once for the whole of life. Wherefore, as often as we fall, we must recall the remembrance of our baptism, and thus fortify our minds, so as to feel certain and secure of the remission of sins. For though, when once administered". (Calvin, p. 1452)

"Moreover, if we have rightly determined that a sacrament is not to be estimated by the hand of him by whom it is administered, but is to be received as from the hand of God himself, from whom it undoubtedly proceeded, we may hence infer that its dignity neither gains nor loses by the administrator. And, just as among men, when a letter has been sent, if the hand and seal is recognized, it is not of the least consequence who or what the messenger was; so it ought to be sufficient for us to recognize the hand and seal of our Lord in his sacraments, let the administrator be who he may". (Calvin, p. 1461)

"Whether the person baptized is to be wholly immersed, and that whether once or thrice, or whether he is only to be sprinkled with water, is not of the least consequence: churches should be at liberty to adopt either, according to the diversity of climates, although it is evident that the term baptize means to immerse, and that this was the form used by the primitive Church." (Calvin, p. 1465)

"If, by baptism, Christ intends to attest the ablution by which he cleanses his Church, it would seem not equitable to deny this attestation to infants, who are justly deemed part of the Church, seeing they are called heirs of the heavenly kingdom". (Calvin, p. 1490)

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:21:38 AM Close
“Our children, before they are born, God declares that he adopts for his own when he promises that he will be a God to us, and to our seed after us. In this promise their salvation is included. None will dare to offer such an insult to God as to deny that he is able to give effect to his promise. How much evil has been caused by the dogma, in expounded, that baptism is necessary to salvation, few perceive, and therefore think caution the less necessary... that children who happen to depart this life before an opportunity of immersing them in water, are not excluded from the kingdom of heaven.” (Calvin, p. 1465, 1467)

28:1 Baptism is a sacrament of the New Testament, ordained by Jesus Christ (Mat 28:19), not only for the solemn admission of the party baptized into the visible Church (1 Cor 12:13); but also, to be unto him a sign and seal of the covenant of grace (Rom 4:11 with Col 2:11, 12), of his ingrafting into Christ (Rom 6:5; Gal 3:27), of regeneration (Titus 3:5), of remission of sins (Mark 1:4), and of his giving up unto God through Jesus Christ, to walk in newness of life (Rom 6:3, 4). Which sacrament is, by Christ’s own appointment, to be continued in His Church until the end of the world (Matt 28:19, 20)."

"28:3 Dipping of the person into the water is not necessary: but Baptism is rightly administered by pouring or sprinkling water upon the person (Mark 7:4; Acts 2:41; 16:33; Heb 9:10, 19-22)."

"28:4 Not only those that do actually profess faith in and obedience unto Christ (Mark 16:15, 16; Acts 8:37, 38), but also the infants of one or both believing parents, are to be baptized (Gen 17:7, 9 with Gal 3:9, 14, and Col 2:11, 12, and Acts 2:38, 39, and Rom 4:11, 12; Matt 28:19; Mark 10:13-16; Luke 18:15; 1 Cor 7:14)."

(Westminster Confession, Chapter XXVIII)

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Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:49:00 AM Close
Dear "njmn"

As you have quoted a lot references from different parts of the scriptures and from the web world, there are many more articles in the web world and justification for Immersion baptism

one such one I had post in this thread
http://keralabrethren.net/boardkb/view.asp?id=1444&forum=General: Believers baptism, which history records from the first century that immersion baptism was a practice as per the scriptures.

The baptism which the acts of Apostles mentions after the assension of Christ is for believers who were born again to witness publically the acceptance of salvation, and those who beleived and baptized were added to the chuch.

Mode of baptism, John baptises in Jesus in RIVER Jordan, a river in not a stream where water sprinkles , came UP OUT OF the water, John batizes in aenon where there is much water, and the eunuch went into the water and came up out.


Yours in Christ
samuel.V.J

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 10:55:45 AM Close
Is it possible for a man to baptize 3000 men by immersion in a single day?

Going in to the water and coming out of the water does not mean they were immersed. Sprinkling was the right form of baptism, later pouring was accepted and then immersion. All the three are right.

If there are many articles on the web about baptism that means there is no definite answer in the Bible. Otherwise any body could show the answer very clearly.

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 11:13:18 AM Close
Think what is possible and what is not possible.

Did all the three thousand carry clothes to change after immersion.

Did any body see how Paul or Jailer, was baptized? Sprinkling or pouring. They did not go to river, sure.

When John baptized how many had extra clothes with them to change over if they were immersed or if water was poured over them?

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Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 11:30:54 AM Close
Dear "njmn"

Well you have come up with probabilities, that what would happen if this was there and this was not there , when 25 person can be baptized in 1/2 hour with one baptist this days, was it impossible for the disciples and all those who were baptised to baptize again the other those who believed, now we have to ask Jesus Christ himself when he went into and came out of of River Jordan what alternate arrangement was there for his dress change. Dear brother it means all those guided by Holy Spirit and wrote the Word of God should be kept in verge of suspicion.


We dont go to the rivers because we dont have in our place, we have tanks and pools the place where we stay.

Where there is a will , there is a way.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 11:33:31 AM Close

Well, keep guessing until you find a definite answer in the Bible. Where there is will there is a way.
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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 11:59:12 AM Close

<<<, when 25 person can be baptized in 1/2 hour with one baptist this days, >>>

utter lies. One hour has 60 minutes. Half hour has 30 minutes. 25 people were baptized in 30 minutes means full of lies.

To get in to water it takes some time.
To get out of water it takes some time
To ask questions it takes some time
To get the answer it takes some time.
All this in about one minute each!! Utter lies

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Reply by : njmn   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 12:07:38 PM Close
Acts 2: 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

One hour has 60 minutes
24 hours have 1440 minutes.

If the number is doubled it is 2880

That mean John was immersing 24 hours without preaching. Still it not 3000

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 1:29:32 PM Close
'njmn,'

You are doubting the Word of God and your only basis of unbelief is your logic. How many baptizers were there? Don't guess, search the scriptures.

Shalom Malekim!!!

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 1:31:22 PM Close
Dear brother Samuel VJ,
Part-1

I welcome a reply that is honoring God and His word. Such replies are not adverse, when it is rooted in the Word of God. They help us to grow together in the Lord. When a reply is demeaning my God and His word, then I will have difficulty. Yours is not one of them. I thank you for that.

It is true that we read and hear only about immersion as the meaning of the Greek word BAPTIZO. I repeated what I read and heard from those whom I respected. Then, one day, a thought came to me and that was, “Is that true?” When such thoughts come to me, I go to work. It is a time consuming work. Reading, hearing, and following are easier. I spent a few hours just to understand what the Holy Spirit teaches about the mode of baptism. Especially to answer the question: “does BAPTIZO mean only immersion and nothing but immersion?” The previous posting of mine was the result. Actually, it was not written down as I posted, but I kept it in the form of a note, for a long time.

Why immersion and not pouring is practiced is relatively easy to understand. Immersion was practiced by John the Baptist and the Lord Jesus Christ. John 3:23 is one of the verses that tell us about it. Even John Calvin admitted this in his commentary. If we consider the action that take place in baptizing a believer, once both of them are in a place of “much water” and has gone into it, then immersion is the most economical way of conducting the baptism.

I was baptized in “much water” in the presence of both believers and Hindus and the mode was by immersion. We have two children, they were baptized following the mode of immersion. Having said this as what I practice, why did I say that pouring is also a scriptural mode? It is only because I was discussing the doctrine about the mode of baptism. Both immersion and pouring are allowed. In the scriptures, we read that when men baptized men, the immersion was followed. On the other hand, when God baptized men, it was by pouring.

(To be cont. part-2)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 1:33:10 PM Close
Dear brother Samuel VJ,
Part-2

Why that difference? If we begin conducting baptism by pouring, then we may fail to make sure that the baptizee’s body is completely covered with water as to indicate a burial. When God does that, He will not fail. For example: In Acts 2 we read that the house was filled when the Holy Spirit was poured out to baptize with the Holy Spirit (Acts 2). All the disciples were in that house and that house was filled. All those who were in that house were baptized. There is no way any one could say that he/she was only partially baptized by that pouring by God. God made the house to be filled. I hope that you could see the problem facing us when we start baptizing a believer by pouring water over him/her. Therefore, immersion is the best and most economical mode of baptizing a believer. At the same time, that is not the only mode of baptism.

Of course, we could make sure that a person is fully covered with water by pouring water using a mug. In India, when one takes a bath, this is the mode of bathing. More than one mug of water is used. By pouring the water over the body, it becomes running water for purification of the body. This is what we read in John 13, about feet washing. After finishing the bathing, the water will dry-up the same way as the person comes out after being submerged in a bathtub or in a swimming pool. To speed-up this process of drying, we may use a towel.

Allow me to deal with the Greek word BAPTIZO for a moment. The meaning of that word is “to make whelmed.” In the English language, the meaning of the word ‘whelm’ is “to cover with water.” Therefore, the easy way to do the baptism is to submerge the baptizee by the baptizer in the water. That act is similar to that of being “overwhelmed.” Therefore, ‘whelm’ is also used to indicate to overcome emotionally or mentally. The baptizee is to be ‘made whelmed’ or ‘covered with water’ is the meaning of baptism. This covering could be done by immersion as well as by pouring.

(To be cont. Part-3)

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 13 Nov 2007 1:33:47 PM Close
Dear brother Samuel VJ,
Part-3

In the above sense we read the word BAPTIZO and BAPTISMOS in Mark 7:4, 8; Luke 11:38; Hebrew 9:10; and so on. This is in relation to the ceremonial washing practiced by the Jews.

Shalom Malekim!!!

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Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 14 Nov 2007 8:06:58 AM Close
Dear "njmn,'

<<Acts 2: 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.>>

<<That mean John was immersing 24 hours without preaching. Still it not 3000 >>

This means you are not even aware about the scriptures , you havent even known what is Acts 2 referring to. It is not Johns Baptism, it is believers baptism after the ascension of Christ, the first conversion and it was Peter and the disciples preaching and the devout jews from all around the world gathered there and they believed about the Christ crucified for thier sins as a sacrifice .

Brother it is good whatever each one believe we have to support with thier limited knowledge but not with a wrong interpretation.


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

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Reply by : samuel.v.j   View Profile   Since : 14 Nov 2007 8:13:20 AM Close
Dear Br.George in Christ,

Thank you very much, for the answer, the expected reply from the word of God. May God help us in future endeavours. Hope you will contine the discussion with "njmn"


Yours in Christ
Samuel.V.J

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Reply by : sambudhanoor   View Profile   Since : 15 Nov 2007 12:04:05 AM Close
Dear njmn

Act 2:41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.

(1) 3000 Gladly received his word, (the Gospel preaching)
(2) They were baptized.

There are 120 disciples present at that time, 3000/120 = 25.
There is no proof that Peter himself done the baptism others also might have done the baptism.

Act 1:15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples (altogether the number of names was about a hundred and twenty), and said,

If water is sprinkled to anybody, shall they need to change the dress or they stay wet?
As this was the first instance they might have stayed wet, as they many not have brought spare dresses.

You said infants also to be baptized?

We are discussing about believers’ baptism, believer means one who put his/her faith in Christ Jesus?

How do infant believe in Christ Jesus?
Does they have the ability to believe?

In Acts of Apostle we can seen it is recorded Believe and baptized, believe and baptized it is repeated. Without believe in Jesus Christ, baptism does not have any effect at all, it can be like a bath, physical cleansing same as the Old Testament rituals.

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

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