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# 01465 :  Proverbs 8: 22-31
Dear brothers,
You are welcome for your thoughts in this subject. This is one of the main verses Jehova Witnessers put up for clarifing that Jesus is not Lord he is created by Jehova. Please go through the verses below.

Proverbs 8
22 "The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, [b] , [c]
before his deeds of old;

23 I was appointed [d] from eternity,
from the beginning, before the world began.

24 When there were no oceans, I was given birth,
when there were no springs abounding with water;

25 before the mountains were settled in place,
before the hills, I was given birth,

26 before he made the earth or its fields
or any of the dust of the world.

27 I was there when he set the heavens in place,
when he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep,

28 when he established the clouds above
and fixed securely the fountains of the deep,

29 when he gave the sea its boundary
so the waters would not overstep his command,
and when he marked out the foundations of the earth.

30 Then I was the craftsman at his side.
I was filled with delight day after day,
rejoicing always in his presence,

31 rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.

With love

Post by : puthusalem  View Profile    since : 1 Dec 2007

Reply by : keralabrethren1   View Profile   Since : 1 Dec 2007 7:03:24 AM Close
Dear Santhosh,

Please read from verse 1 onwards, you will get a clear picture about whom/which it is said there:

Pro 8:1 ¶ Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice?

Pro 8:2 She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths.

Pro 8:3 She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors.

If they say this is about Jesus, they must agree that Jesus was a female, because the feminine pronoun is used here.

Here Solomon tells about wisdom and not anything about Jesus.

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Reply by : wilson609   View Profile   Since : 1 Dec 2007 9:54:11 AM Close
dear puthusalem,
read over and over again john 1:1"In the beginning was the Word,the Word was with God and the word was God".this verse clearly states that the word(jesus) is God.also in Revelation19:13,we read"And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood; and his name is called The Word of God.there is no ambiguity in the fact that Jesus Christ is God.Also please read john 8:53 to 58
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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 3 Dec 2007 7:47:28 AM Close
Dear Santhosh,

As I failed to read any of your insight about these verses, let me be brief.

My first observation is that you have offered no explanation to or against the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ teaching. The three main unscriptural and dangerous teachings of Jehovah’s Witnesses are:
1. They deny the deity of the Son by teaching that he was and is a creature.
2. They claim that all human have some sort of godliness (deity) in them.
3. They deny the sin nature in man.

My second observation is that you are using an erroneous translation. Let me use Proverbs 8:22 to explain this. I am placing a word-by-word translation. The Hebrew word is in caps and its translation is in parenthesis: JHVH (Jehovah) QNNY (possessed me) RASHITH (in the beginning of) DRKOO (His way), QDM (before) MPHYLIW (his works) MAO (from then). This verse was mistranslated in the third century and that was the beginning of the Sabellian heresy. The denial of the deity of the Son was the Pelagian heresy and it started in the 4th century.

If you use the correct and literal translation, then Proverbs 8:22 will change from what you quoted, “"The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works,…” to the following, “Jehovah possessed me in the beginning of his way,…” We should never forget the fact that in order to possess something, what is to be possessed must have existed before being possessed. Since this possessing took place before the creation (“before his deeds of old,” as you quoted), that which came to be possessed was outside the creation. It was not a part of the creation (“deeds of old,” as you quoted). Therefore, Jehovah’s Witnesses’ teaching is erroneous.

Having said this, let me ask a question - expecting a truthful answer, do you use the translation of the Bible by Jehovah’s Witnesses?

Shalom Malekim!!!

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Reply by : puthusalem   View Profile   Since : 3 Dec 2007 11:01:56 PM Close
Dear GPK,
Thank you for your attention, the verses I refered is a kind of KJV from power bible cd software.
With love
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Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 5 Dec 2007 12:20:36 PM Close
Sorry, Santhosh, I have no comments regarding this passage. But I do have a suggestion when encountering JW's:

Use their bible and reference Philipians chapter 2. their bible does not change this passage, and this is a very clear passage on the divinity of Christ.

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