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# 00957 :  "Trusts"
We Brethren have numerous “Trusts” and “committees” amidst of us. The authorities of all these never publish their Bye- laws. The members of most of these trusts are a group people their family members or obedient servants. One or two prominent people will be there as brand ambassadors. These trusts collect money saying that they are brethren. Once they get established, the assets become the property of the trust and not of the brethren. Why cant we insist that we will not give donations to trusts whose Bye-laws are not published.
Post by : boby1  View Profile    since : 11 Oct 2006


Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 11 Oct 2006 5:52:15 PM Close
So insist it!
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Reply by : appachan   View Profile   Since : 12 Oct 2006 12:53:49 PM Close
I would recomend GFTI,which is also a trust ,is run well and audited by independent firms,bye-laws are printed too
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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 12 Oct 2006 8:37:22 PM Close
There may be one or two sincere trusts but let me quot from "Is the brethren movement dead-3" by Dr Johnson C Philip. "These one-man projects, however, were controlled by individuals, who would choose a couple of friends and family members who would be willing to act as rubber stamps. Often the names of these so-called "trustees" were limited to the paper on which these were printed, and there was absolutely no way they could control or influence the flow of funds. There was no question of transparency to them, let alone accountability. Over the last four decades they have milked gullible believers of hundreds of millions of rupees -- and only they know how these funds were used."
when we are being cheated, why the assemblies are keeping quiet and allowing them to flourish.
When the basic unit with administratuve authority instituted by God is local church why belivers form trusts to act above that athority. If combined effort of churches is required why dont we practice the biblical example (2Cor 8:19-21)of electing a person by the local churches for a particular mission.
Does GFTI Bye law provide for the qualification of trust members as given in 2Cor 8:19
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Reply by : wilson609   View Profile   Since : 12 Oct 2006 9:32:12 PM Close
trusts amidst us are not just formed to make money,since many of members of such trusts are already affluent, its the hunger to control assemblies, to have a stranglehold on the assembly, to occupy prominent spots, thus thinking that they are serving god,s people.such will burnup like hay and stubble on the day of reckoning
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Reply by : mathai   View Profile   Since : 12 Oct 2006 11:03:56 PM Close
There is an association or trust called "Steward Association In India" - SAI. They are accountable to none. Brethren in India doesnot have the skill or time to manage the property of their Local Assembly halls and the land in which the hall is located. So most local assemblies purchase the land in the name of SAI. Also, contributing brethren usually look whether the land is in SAI's name, else they wont contribute(Why? i dont know). SAI had innumerable properties in hill statioins like OOty,Kodiakanal etc and even at other places-white missionary inheritance. These have been sold out by SAI. Where the money went, no body knows and since SAI is a closed trust, no body can question it. I have seen the affluent way of spending of SAI money by trust members. The president of SAI is a lifetime president. He used to sponsor candidates to CMC vellore for MBBS. There was a selection mechanism at banglore which was an eye-wash. Many irregularities where relatives and close cricle people were favoured is well known. Lately CMC has withdrawn the benefit.

Last issue of 'suviseshadwani' has an editorial which deplores local assemblies keeping enormous bank balance and Fixed deposits (ofcourse, it is not right). The writer has requested to hand over such funds to trusts for better utilisation for evangelical work. But look the annual financial statement of "trusts", they have huge depostits as FDs, while many evangelists starve.

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Reply by : wilson609   View Profile   Since : 13 Oct 2006 6:38:50 AM Close
its the one of the safest ways, i suppose to register the property of assemblies in the name of an association or trusts which are being run professionally like,GFTI, instead of registering them in the names of a few individuals of the assembly,who later can become arrogant and throw ohters out who do not fall in line with their thinking.assemblies having huge deposits should support the struggling and starving lords servants.we are a small assembly yet we were able to send out on rotation a small help to the evangelists
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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 13 Oct 2006 8:17:54 AM Close
My own understanding is that these matters are very simple, but are made to look like mountains. Each assembly can register a Trust for the assembly and then register the property in the name of the Trust. Sample Trust Bylaws are available with many many assemblies outside Kerala and some inside Kerala. Cost of registration is very low and once registered, you can register it with the Income Tax Department and then submit annual Tax returns. These will all be done by a Chartered Accountant annually after auditing and will cost very little.

Registering the property with an external Trust is encouraging concentration of power in the hands of some powerful administrators, like the ones who use influence to make themselves life-time office bearers. GFTI is not a custodian of property, and so one cannot register property under them, and you will not get any support in managing the property.

As far as I know, most property of halls outside Kerla are registered in the name of the concerned assembly registered as a Trust.

NT princiles do not permit us to register an assembly's property in the name of any centralized agencies or outside committees no matter how 'transparent' they are now, because things can change in the future (and have changed) and that centralization can evolve in the future. God's people, please beware.

Not only that, pl examine to see if these centralized agencies provide any support when the property is in trouble? Very little. Most cases against such Trusts have been lost. I can give examples from Irinjalakuda, Alapuzha, Ranni, Mallassery (Pathanamthitta), Peringamala (Trivandrum) and scores of other places where the property purchased for assemblies have been skillfully manipulated by 'great' people from well-known families. These are writings on the wall. Please read these and register your assembly's plots in the name of the assemblly's own Trust. Those who want help with a sample document, please send e-mail id or address and it will be sent to you.

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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 13 Oct 2006 12:18:03 PM Close
Most of the brethren believers are not aware of the flow of funds and its mismanagement by the so called reputed leaders. Poor believers think that SAI is something reverent, instituted by God. No body has seen its bye- law, but insists that property is to be registered in the name of SAI.
I haven’t seen the article in Suvishesha Dhwani but the lines quoted my Bro Mathai shows how cunningly the editor is trying to pick our pocket. If he is asking the assemblies to utilize the money they have for evangelical work it is spiritual. If he is asking to handover the money to trusts it is cheating. Who has authorized the trusts to do the evangelical work for the assemblies?
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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 14 Oct 2006 9:23:15 AM Close
I feel that this is all because we are not studying the Word and our teachers are not teaching us to follow the Biblical pattern of giving. The pattern is to give through the assembly (II Cor. 8&9) and other portions in Acts. The assembly should send out missionaries and the assembly should give (channel) funds to the needy after much prayer. Any committee formed to channel should be temporary in nature as seen in the New Testament and its office bearers should be willing to abdicate and hand over to others so that no one will develop personal alligence to the committee members.

But even such committees often take authority into their hands and try to control missionaries. Many missionaries are 'taught' to look unto the committees. There are people who use unscriptural means to make themselves qualified to get into the list of the committees, then block others from getting in.

But I understand that committees of brethren like KEMF, GFTI, BRT, IET and the like yearly publish their audited accounts. This is good. But the individual's Trusts are those that do not have any regard for transparency. I have yet to see one private Trust which has published its audited account.

Some private Trust owners will identify those who are not enlisted by KEMF,BRT,GFTI,IET etc and will immediately give them a few thousand rupees and enlist them and make them their 'evangelist' and use their names to solicit more. Some private Trusts start their own magazines and websites and picture themselves as the guardians of brethren assemblies and establish their Trusts in the minds of people. A lot of innocent people fall a prey to these persons. So we must:
1. teach the doctrine of giving in the Bible
2. give through the assembly
3. avoid the Trusts, whether private or committee, as much as possible
4. teach to give through the offering bag so that the 'right' hand will not know what the 'left' has given.
5. request magazines/websites like kb etc not to give publicity to such non-transparent Trusts and money collectors.

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 14 Oct 2006 9:46:02 AM Close
In continuation, allow me to say that the term "we'. "our" are used in a loose way by the believers. The only thing that qualify to be called "we' and "our" are 'we believers of a local assembly' and "our local assembly". The use of these terms cannot be Biblically used outside these restrictions, because outside our local assembly, there is nothing that is common.

The many institutions or Trusts or magazines portrayed even in this website do not belong to "us"/are not 'ours'. But when someone portrays these as those belonging to the brethren, then it becomes "more or less acceptable" over a period of time. This is how the denominational thinking and spirit come in. This is against the doctrine of the local assembly and its independence that has been taught by the brethren.

So any one who starts something (school, gospel team, musical team, Bible school, nursing college, nursing school, hospital, magazine, Trust, Camp site, ministires of various type - might be good and spiritually profitable) cannot be qualified as "ours" or "of the brethren" unless these are started by a local assembly or group of assemblies after much prayer and consultation for meeting local need, as seen in the New Testament.

If we follow this New Testament priciple of local assembly, and disregard the private Trusts, and channel our resources through the local assembly, we will have followed the Biblical principles properly. May we seek the Word and the guidance of the Holy Spirit in these matters. Let us not disregard the local assembly which alone represents the "Bride" of Christ to which only we should have our allegience. We should only be loyal to our local assmbly and its policies. Our assemblies should rise up to this level of New Testament teachings so that Christ alone will be our leader and He alone will be glorified through us and our assemblies.

But who is there to pray and teach these things and practise these with the holy boldness that His Spirit is willing to give us?

May His name alone be glorified.

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Reply by : zionmissioncharitabletrust   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 7:13:03 AM Close
OURS IS A REGISTERED ORGANISATION UNDER THE GOVERNMENT RULES AND REGULATIONS OF THIS COUNTRY.WE ARE HAVING VERY CLEAR BYELAWS AND RULES TO ACT AND DISCHARGE DUTIES.THIS WE HAVE DONE ONLY BECAUSE TO GET TO BOOK THE HALLS AND TO GET MIKE SANCTION AND OTHER PREVILEGES FROM THE GOVT. BY FORMING AND REGISTERING THE TRUST WE CAN DO MANY THINGS .WE ARE DOING THIS. WE CAN DO MANY THINGS. PLEASE PRAY AND SUPPORT OUR MISSION
ZION MISSION CHARITABLE TRUST
KALLIATH SQUARE
PALACE ROAD
TRICHUR
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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 10:23:58 AM Close
We believe that many trusts like KEMF, BRT etc etc are functioning well. But why the trust members even after 20-30 years of voluntary service, in spite of their other important responsibilities, want to continue as the members? Is it because others are not capable of doing this, others are not faithful or do they think that God can work through them only?
Are they willing to accept Bro Philip06’s suggestion “Any committee formed to channel should be temporary in nature as seen in the New Testament and its office bearers should be willing to abdicate and hand over to others so that no one will develop personal allegiance to the committee members.”

Are they ready to include members from churches as mentioned in 2Cor 8:19-21?

These trusts were formed in a period when communication facilities were poor and interactions were difficult. Now that is not the case. The assemblies can distribute their funds by themselves. Other responsibilities like evangelism and teaching must be taken care of by the local assemblies.

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 10:27:35 AM Close
Dear respondent from the ZMCT:

It is interesting to know that you CAN DO MANY THINGS, and this is often seen on some magazines and websites also. Yes, there is no doubt that we can all do many things.

But the fundamental question which we need to find an answer for is:

Who registered Zion Mission Charitable Trust? Was it done by a local assembly in Trichur or by a few individuals personally? If it is registered by any one other than a local assembly for the purpse of mike permit or booking halls, then no matter how good your bylaws are, you are not within the definition of the local assembly. It is these private Trusts and private agenda that we need to keep away from and stay within the definition of the local assembly. This is what I understand from the Word of God.

Please clarify the point raied above.

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 10:44:25 AM Close
With reference to the input by mathai above, may I say that I just read the editorial of Suviseshadhwani. It is not written by the Chief Editor, but by a member of the editorial committee. This brother is an active member or supporter of a Trust which I understand has FD of Rupees l5 lakhs a few years ago. I do not know how much they have in FD now. This is also done when many evangelists are starving.

I believe we should encourage the assemblies not to freeze offering money other than what is set apart for hall construction or supporting halls of places where their own commended workers are labouring. They should then be encouraged to prayerfully support the mission fields and other needy believers directly rather than through a Trust unless it is a designated or nominated support to a specific worker or cause whose information is not easily available. Can't they send to the needy directly? Can't they identify some of the needy people directly? If there is a will, there is a way and the Lord will show the way as we sit in prayer. Why should they entrust it to a Trust? But these days, there is not much difficulty in identifying and supporting workers, assemblies and poor believers.

Let us endeavour to stay within the limits and definitons given to us by the New Testament and let us not deviate from it as much as possible. Let us allow the Spirit to show us the way. Was this not the way they were guided by the Holy Spirit in the yester years? Is not the same Holy Spirit availabel to help us? One or two well intentioned Trusts pave the way for 100 more to emerge and we can't stop them from emerging. So let us not set a bad exampel of recognizing these private Trusts and let us not encouarage these private enterprises to come up and take away the place of the assembly as seen in the New Testament.

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Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 3:03:04 PM Close
Individuals are accountable to the elders of the assembly they fellowship in. Missionaries are accountable to the elders & to the assembly that commended them.

Now where does this leave parachurch organizations like trusts? They are not individuals.

br. Philip above says that we have a misunderstanding of scripture. I disagree, & will address some of his points below.

Just so I don't get accused of bias, let me just say that I am not a board member of a trust, nor do I aspire to be one.

Philip says: "I feel that this is all because we are not studying the Word & our teachers are not teaching us to follow the Biblical pattern of giving. The pattern is to give through the assembly (II Cor. 8&9)."

How do we pick & choose which patterns we follow & which we don't? The original Lord's supper was with unleavened bread & with wine. Yet we use bread & grape juice.

My point is this: Let us follow those commands & principles set forth in scripture. Patterns that are based on one scriptural mention, is subjective prooftexting at best, and legalistic at worst.

But let us lay that aside for a moment, if br. Philip is correct, & we should only be giving to the church, how can a church ably & competently distribute this money accurately?

I submit that Parachurch organizations serve a vital role and it is more stewardly to give through these organizations than through the church. CMML in the US, & MSC in Canada (I don't know about India) distribute this money because they know (for the most part) who is commended & who is not.

Also, in Canada, a church cannot send money to a random person located in a random part of the world. So, in Canada (no idea about the rest of the world), MSC serves to add transparency to the distribution of money. This leads to less accusations of impropriety. They are serving to reduce, if not eliminate entirely, the “appearance of evil”. So some of these parachurch trusts do serve a vital & important role.

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Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 3:08:21 PM Close
Br. Philip goes on to say "The assembly should send out missionaries & the assembly should give (channel) funds to the needy after much prayer."

What happens if I am moved to give to a certain commended worker? We see Paul was supported by other places other than his commending assembly. How can I give directly to this person I have in mind? The assembly can send the money directly to that person, but that runs afoul of the tax laws in some countries. There has to be an avenue to do so. Again, another practical reason for trusts.

Br. Philip says: "Any committee formed to channel should be temporary in nature as seen in the New Testament"

Why? Where? There is no passage supporting this. This is a matter of opinion, not supported one way or another by scripture.

Br. Philip says: "its office bearers should be willing to abdicate & hand over to others so that no one will develop personal alligence to the committee members."

This may be a practical reason, and it may be a good practical reason, but it certainly is not supported by scripture.

------------

We should not endeavor to make arbritrary universal rules for para church organizations when scripture is silent on them.

There may be practical rules to reduce "appearences of evil", as scripture says, but often times, such accusations are made out of jealousy and desire for prominence.

We need to pray for wisdom to discern between the two.

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Reply by : michael   View Profile   Since : 18 Oct 2006 10:20:32 PM Close
ZION MISSION, TRICHUR is like contract labourers. You call them anywhere, they will come and do the contract work. It is good!!!. See their vision and mission and motto and what not, put in the prayer column of kb.net. It looks Christ's church has totally failed and they have taken over! Shame that they are soliciting funds even through this discussion forum.
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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2006 7:56:37 AM Close
Dear Joyboy:

Thanks for your responses to my posts on the parachurch organizations. May I say a few things breifly:

Our primary premise is that of Kerala/probably India too, and not Canada or USA. MSC or CMML are committees, whose only job is to channel funds as entrusted with them witout soliciting, and it is soley for foreign missionaries, about whose fields the local assemblies do not have much information, in terms of regulations and banking channels. Again, these committees are being used not by all, but a few assemblies only. There are many US/Canada assemblies which directly send support to missionaries to several countries, and CMML/MSC is only an alternative for some. From Canada also, there are assemblies which do not use any channelling Trusts, but send money directly.

US/Canada assemblies or their believers do not have any tax problems as their individual assemblies are all registered. So they are not approaching MSC/CMML for this purposes.

So we cannot compare CMML/MSC with the emerging personal/sub-group Trusts which are seen in Kerala.

I understand that the Indian-dominant assemblies in North America can also forward their funds to missionaries and even local assemblies in India through CMML/MSC or even through GMI, a Trust specifically established out of burden for India and the work in India.

But you have to make sure that the funds go to the assemblies/workers commended by the assemblies rather than to individuals and their personal organizations. Perhaps MSC/GMI/CMML might use a similar committee which has full accountability to disburse funds to the assembly/workers/poor believers and the poor in India on a voluntary basis.

But with my understanding about the doctrine of giving in the NT, I feel it is scripturally right to give through the local assemblies in India without middlemen as much as possible. There are many ways to doing it.

(will continue)

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2006 8:08:59 AM Close
Dear Joyboy:

Other comments:

First, the Bible does not speak about parachurch organizations, as the Bible does not envisage one. That is why we have not even a clue about it. For this to be properly understood, we must read,study and understand the concept of local assemly as seen in Acts and in books like I & II Cor., Ephesians, Galatians, I Thesalonians etc. It is not easy to discuss all of these in these columns. Pl look at the giving of Philippian, Antioch, Macedonian, Thesalonian and other churches. They gave through the offering bags (on the Lord's days), met the needs of believers inside and outside their own assemblies, met the needs of God's servants inside and outside, and sent out gifts through 2-3 brothers to meet specific needs. It was all assembly led/directed and the arrangements were temporary. No one individual or a group of men did start any thing of this sort any where in the New Testament.

Secondly, the example of the vine and bread may be re-examined. Many are using it as a matter of convenience, but there are many many assemblies, where they use unleavened bread and pure unfermented grape juice/rasin juice. So, fellow believer, because some are doing it in a new way is no reason why we should do that way at all. This is no justification for using private Trusts to distribute funds for the Lord's work.

Now take a look at and see what is happening:

In North America or Britain (with Echoes of Service), their committee members are not well-known, popular, prominant persons, but mostly men who hide beind the curtain and do what their brethren had asked them to do, of course, with the permission of their local assemblies. They are not 'heroes' who are in several committees like interlocking directories of companies.

Now take the case of even well-meaning Trusts in India: Most of their Secretaries are well know, command great influence, exert serious controls over the evangelists, in some cases even on churches also.

(to continue)

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2006 8:27:39 AM Close
To joyboy:

Many control evangelists and many many have told me that they are afraid of the Secretaries of some of the generally accepted Trusts. There are exceptions also.

Now please take a look at the private Trusts: Their proponents make enormous publicity, some of it is only publicity stunt. They publicise through their websites/magazines. They impress people to think that they are doing something and attract more 'innocent' and less informed donors. They often make foreign visits and solicit openly and shamelessly through the platforms which they create for themselves through their kith and kin and 'friends' they cultivate carefully. They know the marketing technieques that Prof. Philip Kotler has been writing about. They amass wealth, live in great luxury and become 'GMs' of their Trusts. They give some bit to some people to create supporters and keep satisfying them. Some are even publishing malayalam magazines in US/Canada. Many of them have no time for a gospel meeting in a remote part of India, as they are 'fully booked' for so many years internationally. They spend more time in North America and Gulf and rest of the time visiting the 'visiting brethren' from abroad. Most do not have any audit, they mostly do not publish their accounts. I have a lot of information on the many Bible School, Gospel Team, Charitable, Orphanage, Publishing, Trusts who do these. There may be some that are faithful also, I do not know. There are several among the brethren, far too many among our pentecostal friends (no offence please, I do not mean to be judgemental) and among other denominations.

In all of these, the gifts of God's people which ought to go into the offering bags of local assemblies fall into the hands of these personal Trusts. That is SAD.

On the otherhands, there are some profitable work done by Wycliff, Gideons, some Bible Societies and the like, and to all of these, we can give through the local assembly if we so desire. Let the assembly decide on these.

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Reply by : philip06   View Profile   Since : 19 Oct 2006 8:31:04 AM Close
May I be allowed to conclude these comments with the words of joyboy:

"We need to pray for wisdom to discern between the two".

Yes, we need to do this so that God's money from God's people will go to local assembly led causes where the need is great, without the "middlemen" as much as possible.

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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 23 Oct 2006 2:18:34 AM Close
Dear Joyboy
The local assembly is the basic unit instituted by God. And God established a perfect structure for the assembly with Elders Evangelists and Deacons. They are accountable and responsible. We believe that apostles are not there now. They have laid the foundation stone. The elders in an assembly is appointed by God and has got all the resources to feed them. “(Acts 20 28) Take heed unto yourselves, and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit hath made you bishops, to feed the church of the Lord which he purchased with his own blood.”

Todays so called trusts are exerting authority which are not given to them by God. They are acting as apostles (visiting other assemblies and collecting money for those who are needy). By encouraging these people are we not acting like Israelites who asked for a King? Are we not ignoring the King of Kings who is fulfilling all our needs? If I am wrong will you please quote the verses which entrusts anybody other than the local church the work the trusts and leaders now doing?

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Reply by : wilson609   View Profile   Since : 23 Oct 2006 10:04:36 PM Close
its difficult to provide scriptural sanction,for everything done in any local assembly on this earth.the most gifted of the elders of an assembly of which i was a member a few decades ago,truly gifted and undoubtedly anointed to lead the flock,immesurably gifted to minister the word,was also a faculty of a bible school, established by great stalwarts amidst us.because he was convinced that,that the bible school is a para church organaisation and its the local assembly thats entrusted the duty of teaching the word dissociated himself from the bible school.in the meantime he was also lead to beleive that children are not entitled to sing the songs of praise and put their offerings in the offering box.pl do not get me wrong i am not speaking ill of a brother, but would like to bring to notice the consequenses. the assembly split.with bitterness the brethren separated.that bible school is still existing and is doing profitable ministry of training those called to serve our master in his vineyard.while a couple of other bible schools are shut down,because they don't get students. similarly there are trusts run pfofessionally and are supporting the lords servants.if the motives of any endevour is only to gloryfy our master and not to lift self and the family people,it will certainly survive and be of great blessing to god's people.take for instance the nmlp schools in our kerala started by missionaries.they have provided not only bread and butter to so many of our people apart from providing a chance for sowing the seeds of gods word through these schools.today many start schools and orphanages but god will honour such, only if the motives of starting such are pure.
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Reply by : zionmissioncharitabletrust   View Profile   Since : 27 Oct 2006 2:40:02 AM Close
AS BROTHER MICHEL SAID WE ARE CONTRACT LABOURERS. WE DONT HAVE ANY SHAME ON THAT TO BEG TO OTHERS. WE ARE BEGGING TO OTHERS FOR NOT TO BEG BY OTHERS. OURS IS A CHARITABLE ORGANISATION OWNED BY GOVERNMENT.THE PERSONS HEADING THIS TRUST IS WORKING WITH A CLEAR VISION. WE DONT HAVE ANY SHAME TO BEG AND WORK FOR THE VISION. AS MICHEL TOLD THIS CONTRACT LABOURES ARE GOING ANY WHERE CALLED BY ANY ONE BY TAKING LEAVE , SPARING TIME AND MONEY. BECAUSE CHRISTS LOVE COMPELLS US. ALL OUR CONTRACT LABOURES ARE EMPLOYED IN GOOD POSITION.
THEY TAKE LEAVE,SPEND TIME AND MONEY. THESE LABOURERS ARE WORKING WITH THEIR OWN MONEY. BUT WHEREVER REQUESTS ARE MADE BY THE FELLOW BELIEVERS IN THEIR DIFFICULTIES,WE BEG FOR THEM;NOT TO BEG BY THEM
BROTHER MICHEL CAN CHECK AND FIND POSITIONS OF BROTHERS WHO ARE HEADING THE TRUST.DEFNITELY IT IS ABOVE YOUR IMAGINERY LEVELL
JOSE KOONAMPLACKAL
ZION MISSION CHARITABLE TRUST
KALLIATH SQUARE
PALACE ROAD
TRICHUR 680 020
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Reply by : babugeorge01   View Profile   Since : 27 Oct 2006 7:34:13 AM Close
If I have to work for a Company, I must first be recruited by them. I cannot go in and work just because I love to work for them.

If I have to work for the Lord, I must in like manner be called of Him unto the work He has appointed for me.

If I do my Company's work, I will expect my Company to provide all resources to do the work, and all remuneration for my subsistance. I will approach only those who appointed me to the work for these matters.

If I do the Lord's work I will expect the Lord to provide all resources to do the work, and all remuneration for my subsistance. I will approach only Him for these matters.

If earthly masters know how, when, and how much to remunerate their employees, we agree that the Lord knows better.

When a person working for the Lord appeals for funds, I am disturbed.

Babu

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Reply by : joa   View Profile   Since : 27 Oct 2006 7:39:51 AM Close
Yes Lord will definetly provide the needs of His children. And he has provided the required things for them ,to you and me here in this earth.

We(other believers) are the courier agencies of Lord. And the sender wants the full amount/thing to deivered at the destination without delay and damage.

If one courier agency is not doing that task properly, the sender is having full right and wisdom to give that duty to another agency. Be careful. Nothing to lose at the destination lose is for the courier agency who mishandled the parcel

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Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 28 Oct 2006 1:46:10 AM Close
Dear Brethren in Christ,

There are many Gods servants ministering in different parts of the world , particularly in India, which are several times unknown to we individual believers, if we are aware about them , then we can directly support them in our prayers and financial support. If not the apt way to support our evangelist in the vineyard is through KEMF or GFTI , they have almost every evangelist in thier directory, and a portion of our gifts which is sent to them are equally disbursed as per thier norms. And while we give let us not look to who the persons are sitting in this Funds or Trusts , we are giving for Gods work and his glory, if it is not utilised properly, then God will take it into account. And let us pray that it may reach the needed at proper time. We often say that God will take care of our Evangelists , it is sure God will, but how, if no one gives to them, they and thier family will have to starve, thier children will have no Good education, do we want them to be like that, no should be our answer. So let us pray and support the evangelisation ministry and our evangelist , if many of unreached souls may be reached.


Uours in Christ
nelnob1


Yours in Christ
nelnob1

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Reply by : zionmissioncharitabletrust   View Profile   Since : 28 Oct 2006 3:57:38 AM Close
GOD IS HELPING BELEIVERS THROUGH BELEIVERS NOT AS SAID BY BABU GEORGE. HE WILL BE HELPING THO BELEIVERS . POULOSE IS AN EXAMPLE.HE WAS COLLECTING MONEY FOR POOR PEOPLE. SAY IN THE ACHAI. IT WAS A DEBT TO THEM
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Reply by : chackochan   View Profile   Since : 28 Oct 2006 2:09:22 PM Close
zionmissioncharitabletrust - Pleas use Small letters when you type. Thank you.
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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 29 Oct 2006 2:35:53 AM Close
Dear brothers
We each one of us survive only because He cares for us. We have a blessed hope. We also have the responsibility to support our fellow believers in need. All agreed. But I am not getting the answer for the following questions
We brethren claim that we do things as per the Bible. When it comes to the trusts and committees little bit deviation is allowed. Why? Is this because God doesn’t know people working in remote places? Why the assemblies do not elect people as in 2Cor 8:19-21 to distribute money if necessary? Why the bye-laws of the trusts insist that new members of the trust are to be nominated by existing members? Why the trust members are life members? Why the trusts do not publish their bye-laws?
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Reply by : michael   View Profile   Since : 30 Oct 2006 5:25:17 AM Close
Dear Br. Jose Koonamplackal
Even if you are begging for others, it is against God's promise.

1 Psalms 37:25 I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread.

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Reply by : groom   View Profile   Since : 31 Oct 2006 2:11:43 AM Close
Many trusts (like KEMF, BRT, IET....) are doing a commendable service for the ministries and brethren around. But as commended by someone above, we see all the old faces (and names) being repeatedly stuck to the positions. This do not mean that you have to change the office bearers every year. Let us have a continuity of leadership and policies, which will help us to work effectively for the accomplishment of our vision (if we have one!)

But why not we suggest that 1/3 of the members in all committees (executive, administrative or regulatory in nature) voluntarily retire every year to have an ewual number of new members from our assemblies who will defenitly bring in new visions, plans and ideas. Let us start with the longest serving memebers. They can come back next year, if need be felt by the committe in general.

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Reply by : thomasdelhi   View Profile   Since : 31 Oct 2006 6:02:42 AM Close
What we should not encourage is Trusts owned and run by an individual with his family just for themselves without any accountability to the local brethren/assembly (closed Trusts). It is true that God will judge them but precious money lost there could have been utilised for God's work.
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Reply by : thomasdelhi   View Profile   Since : 31 Oct 2006 6:05:05 AM Close
Concentration of money and power could corrupt any sincere believer. Personal Trusts means this concentration and it currupts.
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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 31 Oct 2006 9:32:14 AM Close
There are numerous trusts and societies in the secular world doing social work. But the funding agencies ask for the bye-laws before granting any aid. I strongly feel that

1) It is high time to educate our believers and assemblies to assess the bye-law of the trust before sending them money.
2) We must not encourage the trusts to acquire assets
3) The bye- law must have provision for membership to people elected by assemblies.
4) They must publish the detailed accounts. Not the audited balance sheet alone. (Even BRT, KEMF etc publish only the certificate by the Charted accountant. They certify only that the accounts are correct. They do not verify whether it was spent for Lords work or for the luxury of committee members)

Again I refer to Cor 8:19-21

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Reply by : mollythomas   View Profile   Since : 1 Nov 2006 5:57:38 AM Close
arengilum evidenghilum picha eduthottae michalae.nammalu picha kodukaruthu. nammalu arkum onnum kodukaruthu. oralkum onnum kodukaruthu. koduthal pinnae thirinju kadikum allae. anubavam undu allae. areyum viswasikaruthu. ellarum pattippisam anu. ella trustgalum pattippisam anu. kem brt abti kbci gfti ert egt bsi gdn ellam adhigaram kayyalan ulla oro vazhi athrae ullu.
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Reply by : mollythomas   View Profile   Since : 1 Nov 2006 6:03:31 AM Close
michel, dont do anything which is not written in the bible. see michel poulose begged. dont forget it. vallappozhum oke onnu beg cheyyunnathu nallatha.athu polae mappu parayunnathum. veruthae kurae karyanghalu paranju samayam kalayathe poyi valla randu tract kodukan nokkentachaya. athenghilum randennam koduthal valla gunam kittum. onnum cheyyulla cheyyunnore vimarshichondu nadakum
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Reply by : nelnob1   View Profile   Since : 1 Nov 2006 10:15:38 PM Close
Dear Brethren in christ,

Sorry to interrupt, some other tounges rather than english are visible, which will be difficult for anyone rather than any malaylaee brethren in the discussion forums to identify for what the discussion are going on.

Yours in Christ
nelnob1

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Reply by : boby1   View Profile   Since : 4 Nov 2006 9:18:36 AM Close
Dear brothers
I think we had a lively and serious discussion regarding the functioning of the trusts. We appreciate the efforts of most of the trusts. There is a general feeling against the trust members continuing for their life time. It is also doubted that the present generation trusts are deviating from the values and commitments compared to the former ones.

The Trusts are supposed to make their transactions and bye-laws transparent. But nobody gave an explanation why the trusts are not doing so. If the trusts do not publish their accounts and bye-laws then they have something to hide.

The assemblies and Donors must be careful enough to identify the tactics of Gibeonites among us. Such people who keep the money box of “Judas” will loose their temper if some body ask about it.

Lets conclude it as “Trust” is a necessary evil (not supported by Bible).

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Reply by : sudheer1   View Profile   Since : 10 Nov 2006 12:53:08 AM Close
This thread may help you to answer your Queries which was posted under
Re:Steward Association
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Reply by : abc   View Profile   Since : 16 Nov 2006 9:28:22 PM Close
Prayer requests are being circulated for a new type trust started in kerala. Cutting is pasted below:

"Prayer request from PAUL-TIMOTHY Trust.
We are requesting prayer support from partners for a great Commission enterprise. A great Commission enterprise is a business unit for the spreading the kingdom of God. The concept is to have a group of Christian professionals running an enterprise which they are competent to run. The professionals will put in their work free of cost and this will lead to reasonable profit. In the process they will be employing a lot of people with whom they may get an opportunity to share Gospel. The profit will be used for the work of the Lord. The business will be run in the most ethical way to demonstrate that in this corrupt world, a believer can run an enterprise in a truthful way with the help of special grace from God.

Paul- Timothy Trust, a trust of Brethren professionals have come together for a Great Commission Enterprise in Trivandrum . Paul & Timothy (name changed) and a few other believers are supervising this project in Trivandrum. We are developing a real estate and constructing an apartment near Medical College , one of the most important Parts of Trivandrum. The construction quality will be high unlike usual apartments. There will be about 18 units there. We plan to run lodging and boarding facility for the bye standers of the Patients visiting the hospitals in Trivandrum and to have a ministry among them also. Some units have already been booked by our brethren and we are trying to make it a believer's apartment complex. We are looking for Brethren for the remaining units as well. It will have a small conference hall also for spiritual meetings. Please pray for the enterprise so that God will be glorified."

Is this also part of the "Great Commission"?

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Reply by : kumbanadan   View Profile   Since : 16 Nov 2006 11:59:58 PM Close
hello abc
I know 'Paul' and 'Timothy'.
I know their project too, It is REAL ESTATE business and great commissions too.
Honey, It Is Money!
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